Newer ever take Klarnas word for anything. They are the fine and Dandy company whose business model involved by routine fishing for customers bank authorization credentials.
Customer support for cheap companies is someone in a call center in India or some other country with obscenely low wages, following a bad flow chart with limited access and less autonomy. To match it you basically just need the LLM to parse the interaction into following the flowchart, and even when it struggles to do so, you’re comparing it to a minimum wage, probably uneducated, worker in a non-English speaking country.
So “customer service” (the bastard child of huge companies and low wages) is actually just a really bad product to start with, and now Klarna has just replaced it with something that functions just as bad? Yeah I think that makes sense.
I don’t nave a citation, but in general, layoffs are usually used to cut costs. Spending less means more profits. More profits generally means the company looks better to the investors, and hence, better stock price.
Companies will time layoffs to get a better profit in the next couple months to report better quarterly or yearly earnings reports. How those earnings reports turn out directly affects the stock market performance, which in turn makes the shareholders significantly more money.
This is most effective if somebody’s trying to pump the stock value before jumping ship in the most egregious cases.
Often companies have layoff packages that pay workers X months of pay as a severance agreement, doesn’t that mean they would be paying triple wages for some number of employees? Wouldn’t that bring their costs up?
The timing is quite important. Other things to consider are tax periods, bonuses, and nature of the markets. That can all be racked up as cost of doing business if the long-term benefits outweigh the long-term costs.
Especially if they are having a bad year or quarter, performing layoffs can show promise of a better next quarter since severance is basically a fixed cost to the number of employees you have.
There isn’t necessarily one size fits all but the bottom line is dropping employees saves money as human resources are always one of the largest costs of operating.
“I’m glad we could solve your problem. Please rate you experiance with our customer support today” Closes support chat window
Klarna: “Customers rate the AI assistant the same as the Human support workers” [all non-responses]
When Klarna says “customer ratings of the AI are the same as for human workers”, what on earth do they mean?
It also contradicts the experiences people have been having with GPT powered chatbots recently. A model that takes a few prompts to start hallucinating is better than a living breathing human being? Really? I’d be curious to give it a try.
I worked for large companies before, and I even interviewed for Klarna (they have been hiring lots recently, maybe for different tasks/positions), and they always lie. Always.
At one company I worked at before, some KPI was calculated incorrectly and had been for years. When we informed the relevant person of this, they got very defensive and refused to change it. Only our team knew the calculation was total BS. It was become success/money was at stake for him. This person continued to send the fake KPI calculations to everyone every week.
I got laid off from the company where I work with absolutely ZERO motivation as to how me being laid off would increase “efficiency” (even though that was their claim — they are slimming down the company to increase “efficiency”). The company ignored every piece of evidence I provided to show that me and my team are completely overworked and that they should probably cut jobs elsewhere if they don’t want all of our data ingestions and ML models to collapse.
I don’t think companies have enough to motivate such a layoff if they can’t solidify their numbers and make then transparent to the public. I’d certainly like to see the union fights Klarna will have with the Swedish worker unions now. I have never been to such a meeting though, but I’ve provided motivation for the union to use to oppose layoffs in such meetings - my understanding is that it’s a bit of a shit show.
Yeah… we’re having this with one of our suppliers right now…
We’re showing them all the issues they aren’t solving and they’re saying “look all our KPI numbers look amazing”
So now we have to explicitly go into each ticket and mark it as dissatisfied, since they don’t take into account how long the ticket was open, how many meetings had to be called over the ticket, etc. just whether it was closed without clicking the extra “we’re dissatisfied” button
So now we have to explicitly go into each ticket and mark it as dissatisfied, since they don’t take into account how long the ticket was open, how many meetings had to be called over the ticket, etc. just whether it was closed without clicking the extra “we’re dissatisfied” button
That sucks. A rigid KPI that is never open to change and only made to show some BLING in meetings, it will always lead to failure.
And when the KPIs are bad, they blame us. We had lots of failures in streaming videos on our platform and it was growing across a range of mobile OSs and devices, and they would just say, very sternly, “We need you to deliver better results!”. Meanwhile, they had us do a huge migration and rebuild the entire UI across all devices all while maintaining the legacy systems that are sometimes riddled with bugs. Fucking idiots! They shouldn’t expect X performance with Y² the number of tasks (I would have said 2*Y if it was “double” the work… it was more like being on steroids, it was Y² the work, everyone was burnt out, people barely took the summer off). We met those KPIs by a margin previously, and we’re not about to meet them now unless they hire more staff or give us more time until their new UI launch. Spoiler: the launch did not go well.
Yeah, that’s always been my experience with KPIs, too.
It’s always turned into a game for managers - they don’t have the ability to actually improve the product, so the measurements change or they add an extra field in the ticket…
My first job was as a cashier and we were trained to press the calculate button on the register after each item we scanned. Did that make the checkout go faster? Nope. Did it make their measurement look better? Yeah, since that wasn’t “checkout time” in their report
At another job, patches weren’t merged fast enough. So, instead of making any changes that would improve the product, we were ordered to make one ticket for investigating the problem and a second for integrating the fix. It made fixing issues slower, but their KPIs went up…
Well clearly they should’ve done two decades long peer reviewed studies and even then we’d scoff and say they’re obviously corrupted by *waves hands* you know, money, capitalism, you know, the system
It’s not blind trust to think companies probably try to make the most money out of the available resources. It’s sorta what they do
Okay, just to be clear here, we’re talking about the belief that Klarna has sufficiently motivated this decision to lay these people off and actually has good KPIs that measure the performance, specifically that of customer care agents… not that companies make money with resrouces.
Usually people with this kind of opinion like yours maybe haven’t experienced work at a large company or maybe don’t understand that office politics are alive and kicking. But I’d still like to hear why… Let me ask you, what makes you think Klarna is being honest about their measurements?
You don’t think a big company like Klarna has metrics to follow the efficiency of their workers? Even small businesses where I live that and every single big corporation. What makes you think Klarna would be different?
not that companies make money with resrouces.
You misunderstood. I said try to make most money out of the resources, so efficiency. That’s what we’re talking about…
Usually people with this kind of opinion like yours maybe haven’t experienced work at a large company or maybe don’t understand that office politics are alive and kicking
Lol.
Let me ask you, what makes you think Klarna is being honest about their measurements?
It’s not very hard to believe what they’re saying here and they’d be the ones to have those metrics. So simple 1+1.
Citation needed? We’re going to take Klarna’s word for it?
The LLM worked better than the Indian service agent I got to talk to, however after I got an agent speaking my language things resolved
Newer ever take Klarnas word for anything. They are the fine and Dandy company whose business model involved by routine fishing for customers bank authorization credentials.
Trust the robot. Robots never lie. Also I’m not a robot. Beep
I actually believe it.
Customer support for cheap companies is someone in a call center in India or some other country with obscenely low wages, following a bad flow chart with limited access and less autonomy. To match it you basically just need the LLM to parse the interaction into following the flowchart, and even when it struggles to do so, you’re comparing it to a minimum wage, probably uneducated, worker in a non-English speaking country.
The bar is wildly low.
So “customer service” (the bastard child of huge companies and low wages) is actually just a really bad product to start with, and now Klarna has just replaced it with something that functions just as bad? Yeah I think that makes sense.
To quote flamingo_pinyata: “Zero equals zero”
Watch their stocks. 🤣
I would really appreciate it if anyone could share some video or article or something that explains the relation between stocks and layoffs.
I don’t nave a citation, but in general, layoffs are usually used to cut costs. Spending less means more profits. More profits generally means the company looks better to the investors, and hence, better stock price.
I’m only taking about the relation between stocks and stupid decisions.
Wish I understood what drives the yearly layoffs tide
Companies will time layoffs to get a better profit in the next couple months to report better quarterly or yearly earnings reports. How those earnings reports turn out directly affects the stock market performance, which in turn makes the shareholders significantly more money.
This is most effective if somebody’s trying to pump the stock value before jumping ship in the most egregious cases.
Often companies have layoff packages that pay workers X months of pay as a severance agreement, doesn’t that mean they would be paying triple wages for some number of employees? Wouldn’t that bring their costs up?
Good points!
The timing is quite important. Other things to consider are tax periods, bonuses, and nature of the markets. That can all be racked up as cost of doing business if the long-term benefits outweigh the long-term costs.
Especially if they are having a bad year or quarter, performing layoffs can show promise of a better next quarter since severance is basically a fixed cost to the number of employees you have.
There isn’t necessarily one size fits all but the bottom line is dropping employees saves money as human resources are always one of the largest costs of operating.
Thanks for the explanation
“I decide what the tide will bring.”
-Nami
So basically it’s because of a fish girl.
What could they possibly cite?
“I’m glad we could solve your problem. Please rate you experiance with our customer support today”
Closes support chat window
Klarna: “Customers rate the AI assistant the same as the Human support workers” [all non-responses]
@[email protected] exactly this in the comment above!
When Klarna says “customer ratings of the AI are the same as for human workers”, what on earth do they mean?
It also contradicts the experiences people have been having with GPT powered chatbots recently. A model that takes a few prompts to start hallucinating is better than a living breathing human being? Really? I’d be curious to give it a try.
I worked for large companies before, and I even interviewed for Klarna (they have been hiring lots recently, maybe for different tasks/positions), and they always lie. Always.
At one company I worked at before, some KPI was calculated incorrectly and had been for years. When we informed the relevant person of this, they got very defensive and refused to change it. Only our team knew the calculation was total BS. It was become success/money was at stake for him. This person continued to send the fake KPI calculations to everyone every week.
I got laid off from the company where I work with absolutely ZERO motivation as to how me being laid off would increase “efficiency” (even though that was their claim — they are slimming down the company to increase “efficiency”). The company ignored every piece of evidence I provided to show that me and my team are completely overworked and that they should probably cut jobs elsewhere if they don’t want all of our data ingestions and ML models to collapse.
I don’t think companies have enough to motivate such a layoff if they can’t solidify their numbers and make then transparent to the public. I’d certainly like to see the union fights Klarna will have with the Swedish worker unions now. I have never been to such a meeting though, but I’ve provided motivation for the union to use to oppose layoffs in such meetings - my understanding is that it’s a bit of a shit show.
Yeah… we’re having this with one of our suppliers right now…
We’re showing them all the issues they aren’t solving and they’re saying “look all our KPI numbers look amazing”
So now we have to explicitly go into each ticket and mark it as dissatisfied, since they don’t take into account how long the ticket was open, how many meetings had to be called over the ticket, etc. just whether it was closed without clicking the extra “we’re dissatisfied” button
That sucks. A rigid KPI that is never open to change and only made to show some BLING in meetings, it will always lead to failure.
And when the KPIs are bad, they blame us. We had lots of failures in streaming videos on our platform and it was growing across a range of mobile OSs and devices, and they would just say, very sternly, “We need you to deliver better results!”. Meanwhile, they had us do a huge migration and rebuild the entire UI across all devices all while maintaining the legacy systems that are sometimes riddled with bugs. Fucking idiots! They shouldn’t expect X performance with Y² the number of tasks (I would have said 2*Y if it was “double” the work… it was more like being on steroids, it was Y² the work, everyone was burnt out, people barely took the summer off). We met those KPIs by a margin previously, and we’re not about to meet them now unless they hire more staff or give us more time until their new UI launch. Spoiler: the launch did not go well.
Yeah, that’s always been my experience with KPIs, too.
It’s always turned into a game for managers - they don’t have the ability to actually improve the product, so the measurements change or they add an extra field in the ticket…
My first job was as a cashier and we were trained to press the calculate button on the register after each item we scanned. Did that make the checkout go faster? Nope. Did it make their measurement look better? Yeah, since that wasn’t “checkout time” in their report
At another job, patches weren’t merged fast enough. So, instead of making any changes that would improve the product, we were ordered to make one ticket for investigating the problem and a second for integrating the fix. It made fixing issues slower, but their KPIs went up…
You assume support agents don’t hallucinate
🤣 yeah true
I feel like customer service has been on a decline for the past 10 years or so. I owe it to being underpaid and treated badly as an employee. .
Well clearly they should’ve done two decades long peer reviewed studies and even then we’d scoff and say they’re obviously corrupted by *waves hands* you know, money, capitalism, you know, the system
700 people deserve some kind of study at least before their livelihood is cut off.
I’m sure they have some metrics of their own they use to follow the efficiency of their workers that they’ve used to compare
I’m sure your blind trust in Klarna is totally reasonable.
It’s not blind trust to think companies probably try to make the most money out of the available resources. It’s sorta what they do
Okay, just to be clear here, we’re talking about the belief that Klarna has sufficiently motivated this decision to lay these people off and actually has good KPIs that measure the performance, specifically that of customer care agents… not that companies make money with resrouces.
Usually people with this kind of opinion like yours maybe haven’t experienced work at a large company or maybe don’t understand that office politics are alive and kicking. But I’d still like to hear why… Let me ask you, what makes you think Klarna is being honest about their measurements?
You don’t think a big company like Klarna has metrics to follow the efficiency of their workers? Even small businesses where I live that and every single big corporation. What makes you think Klarna would be different?
You misunderstood. I said try to make most money out of the resources, so efficiency. That’s what we’re talking about…
Lol.
It’s not very hard to believe what they’re saying here and they’d be the ones to have those metrics. So simple 1+1.